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Lori Fast's avatar

I think John 3:19 is relevant when it comes to thinking about wrath and judgment - that “the light has come into the world and people loved darkness rather than light.” That to me echoes what you’re saying.

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Peter Mario Grach's avatar

Dr Beck,

My thoughts concerning sin and the fall were somewhat startlingly affected some time ago when I read 1 Peter 1: 20. 1 Peter 1: 20 He indeed was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you...

This verse (and some others, like Ephesians 1: 4-6) indicate to me that God (the Trinity) planned from eternity that man would sin, fall, and would therefore require a Saviour to be rescued from death.

Also that through the process of Justification and Sanctification God would produce a 'New Creation', a 'new man' ('put off the old man') that would be prepared, appropriate and fit to enter and live life on the Godly plane in God's Kingdom ('Kingdom Life').

And furthermore, I speculate that this new life, growth and process will continue for eternity - since God is unlimited (also: Ps 82: 11 You will show me the path of life; In your presence is fullness of joy; At Your right hand are pleasures forevermore - especially last 7 words).

I also speculate that God may endow us (humanity) with some measure of semi-autonomy as we progress and grow throughout eternity, and are given/appointed to serve in various projects ('Do you not know that we shall judge angels"...: 1 Corinthians 6: 3). The analogy of Delegated Legislation may apply here, where, for example, a Federal Government delegates to a State or Territory the authority to make laws, regulations, etc. for that State or Territory (as occurs in Australia in the case of the Northern Territory and the Australian Capital Territory).

One limitation with this speculation of mine however, is that I recognise that whatever 'functionality' a created entity, creature or being has (ie., its capacities, strengths, weaknesses, etc.) have all originated and been given by the creator in the first place.

I therefore believe Man was made fallible, faulty, incomplete, limited (doesn't have the full sum of knowledge, for instance, on any, or most matters), and it was inevitable that Adam and Eve would fail and sin - sooner or later - and especially as did occur - when subjected to the deception, temptation, lies and deceit of the snake (Satan); for as it is almost 'hinted' and 'given-away', - 'Now the serpent was more cunning than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made': Ge. 3: 1.

Also: 1 Tim.2: 14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived, fell into transgression.'

Eve was deceived; Adam wasn't. I don't understand why Adam went along with eating the 'apple'. That is not disclosed. The usual thing that is said here by some is that he went along because Eve threatened to withhold 'nookie' if Adam wouldn't comply. I think that is total rubbish!

It is obvious (to me at least) that they were out of their depth and unable to resist, respond in the appropriate way. They were not trained (as good commandos, etc.) to reject and resist the bad (evil) - at least not trained exhaustively enough in doing and responding to what is the right thing to do.

In short, they were faulty, fallible, incomplete.

It may seem that I am trying to put the blame on God for what happened at the Garden of Eden.

To some extent, yes, I think God planned for the fall, and sin to happen.

But that is not the end of the story.

My speculation is that God planned it this way so that eventually He would/could bring about the New Creation of man, prepared, and fit for His Kingdom life - as mentioned earlier - for the best outcome possible and realizable.

I don't know all the pieces of the puzzle, but am just trying to figure out what can make the most sense of what information is supplied and given in the scriptures.

One scripture that may be relevant here is Romans 8: 18 For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us. v9. For the earnest expectation of the creation eagerly waits for the revealing of the sons of God. (NKJV).

( I sometimes think that Paul 'knew' that to eventuate since he had experienced healings, visions, etc. ('not lawful for a man to utter': 2 Cor.12: 4), but we [ I ] haven't had that experience (just some 'by-the-way' comment from me).

I would just like to mention that I believe in a form of Universalism as my theological position. I am somewhat eclectic about/in what I come to accept, believe and embrace.

I totally reject Limited atonement, or any theology remotely espousing anything like that.

I tend to favour what you have written about synergism and monergism (vis-a-vis its possible application to/with free will and determinism). It could work.

There may be some connections or relevance with some of what I have mentioned above (eg. 'delegated legislation' and 'semi-autonomy' and 'creator-created' and 'creator giving all the features, capacities, characteristics to His creation in the first place').

Anyway, thank you for reading some of my speculations and ideas.

Thanks for your thought-provoking articles and writings,

Yours faithfully,

Kind Regards,

Peter Grach

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